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ForumsCompounding & FormulationHow do you guys store your vials when traveling — need advice

How do you guys store your vials when traveling — need advice

SkepticalSean Thu, Mar 7, 2024 at 1:12 PM 17 replies 2,120 viewsPage 1 of 4
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SkepticalSean
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Mar 7, 2024 at 1:12 PM#1

This is the version of the explanation I wish somebody had given me, written down before I forget what confused me. It is about compounded supply, and it is deliberately narrow — everything I am not confident about is marked as such.

What is actually established

They are two different exemptions from the same federal requirements and they buy different things. A 503A pharmacy is regulated primarily by the state board, needs a patient-specific prescription, is exempt from CGMP, and may use a bulk substance that has a USP monograph, is a component of an approved drug, or appears on the 503A bulks list — three independent doorways. A 503B outsourcing facility registers with the FDA, is inspected on a risk basis, must comply with CGMP, may compound for office stock without a patient-specific prescription, and has one doorway to a permitted bulk substance: the 503B bulks list, or the drug shortage list.

The condition it depends on

Worth adding the genuine exception, because it is real and narrow: a change made for an identified patient where the prescriber determines it produces a significant clinical difference for that patient. A grid of fixed doses offered to everybody is not that, whatever the intake form says.

The practical version

Two things anyone can check: a state licence number for a 503A, and an FDA outsourcing-facility registration for a 503B. Both are publicly searchable, and a pharmacy unwilling to give you either has answered the question.

What I am not sure about

What I actually want to know is what actually distinguishes 503A from 503B, in terms of what each may make and from what starting material. I have searched first, so if this is covered somewhere point me at it and I will read it.

— SkepticalSean · corrections welcome and will be edited into this post with credit
34 12DerekSJ_a1c, paige_pharma, emma_london and 31 others
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Dr.NateNeph
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Mar 7, 2024 at 2:39 PM#2
SkepticalSean said:
They are two different exemptions from the same federal requirements and they buy different things.

That is correct as far as it goes, and here is where it stops going. Resolution therefore closed the doors unevenly, and the asymmetry follows from the bulks lists. For 503B the shortage clause was the only route to these molecules, so that route shut completely. A 503A pharmacy can still argue a doorway via "component of an approved drug" — but only for the substance in the form present in the approved product, which is exactly where the base-versus-salt argument lives, and it does nothing about the copy restriction, which came back into force on resolution.

Last edited: Mar 7, 2024 at 4:39 PM
35 13NauseaFreeNow, SteveThurs, B12Beth and 32 others
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anders_CPH
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Mar 7, 2024 at 4:05 PM#3
SkepticalSean said:
They are two different exemptions from the same federal requirements and they buy different things.

Pushing back on SkepticalSean here. A research-chemical supplier selling lyophilised powder labelled research use only is not compounding and is not claiming to. It is a different legal universe with no pharmacy oversight, no patient relationship and no content guarantee, and conflating the two in these threads helps nobody.

36 14AussieAnna, BethLabQueen, ChrisMacros and 33 others
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PeptideChemSF
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Mar 7, 2024 at 5:31 PM#4

Taking the question as asked, rather than the general version of it. The shortage clause is the answer to the second question and it is a subtraction rather than an addition. Both exemptions forbid compounding something that is essentially a copy of a commercially available approved product. A product FDA has listed as in shortage is not treated as commercially available, so listing removed the objection that otherwise blocked compounding. It never created a permission; it withdrew a prohibition, which is why it evaporated the moment the supply fact changed.

Last edited: Mar 7, 2024 at 9:31 PM
37 15ricardo_MIA, BrianDallas92, labquiet_amy and 34 others
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tammy_FL
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Mar 8, 2024 at 1:54 AM#5
Dr.NateNeph said:
Resolution therefore closed the doors unevenly, and the asymmetry follows from the bulks lists.

Second this.

38 16mike_mealprep, NicoleRaleigh, james_edin and 35 others
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